Illegal immigration is such an emotional issue. Many illegal immigrants feel that if they get across and keep their noses clean and work hard, the government will somehow overlook the lawbreaking that got them here – especially if they have an "anchor baby". I agree with Lou Dobbs (CNN's outspoken news dude) that if you can't control your nation's borders, you can't reform immigration. We know in Texas that our border is a joke. Many illegal aliens, some in our church, go and come for holidays and family parties at will. Any reform must begin with a serious effort to control the border (I smile when reporters say "between 9 and 11 million illegal aliens — how do they know?). We, as a sovereign nation, have a right to control and defend our borders — and this includes who gets in and for what reason.
Could I climb the fence around your house, move into your house without permission, refuse to become a part of your family's culture or learn your family's language, then demand that your family pay for my education and medical care?
These protests have our family on high steam — especially Esther. All the illegal alien children get free education (including 2 free meals a day), free medical care, etc., things they would not get in Mexico, and they protest and march, waving another country's flag? Esther says that if we marched in Mexico with no papers, waving the American or Guatemalan flag, we would all go to jail! Stephanie said that many of the McHi students that drive in from Reynosa every day (and use a relative's McAllen address to get free education) were running through the halls singing Mexico's national anthem. Um, exactly what are they upset about?
But don't get me started on the American hypocrites, either. Big business LOVES the cheap labor illegal aliens provide, and many of the "get tough" lawmakers have illegal gardeners, nannies and housekeepers. And let's be honest. The U.S. government does not want to control the border, or they would do it! Are you telling me it's not possible to stop illegal immigration on the border if we have the will to do it? No, the US is addicted to cheap, migrant labor and so has a vested interest in keeping it coming, no matter how much screaming comes from border state ranchers, hospitals, schools, and law enforcement personnel.
AMNESTY
I just have to laugh when the Senate suggests dividing illegal aliens into 3 groups. How in the wide world of sports are they gonna know who has been here 2 years, 5 years or 10 years? In 1986, when Reagan offered amnesty, Mexicans poured across the border by the thousands, generating false receipts and documents by the thousands to gain amnesty. The corruption is so great, there is NO WAY to sort out who deserves it and who doesn't. And what about the people patiently waiting their turn in the system, the people who have filled out forms and paid thousands of dollars to come legally? They get leap-frogged over by lawbreakers and opportunists?
NO EASY ANSWER
There is no simple answer to this problem, but the solution MUST begin by controlling entrance at our joke of a southern border NOW. Then, we can try to deal with those who are here without permission, but if we do some kind of weird amnesty or "path to citizenship" without controlling the border, it would be the same as welcoming guests in your front door while your backyard is on fire. The House bill is seriously flawed. Under that law, if you gave a ride or food to an illegal alien, you could go to jail for 5 years! A little too severe, in my way of thinking. We, obviously, have many friends and a few church members who are undocumented. We love them and treat them with respect and dignity, and my policy has always been to help in any way I can to get legal papers for anyone who asks, but we can't condone illegal immigration either. A waitress friend of ours approached us trembling and crying last month, scared to death of a wall being built on the border. "How will I see my babies," she asked us, "if they build a wall"? This is difficult. Anyway, no easy answers, but first, border enforcement, then solutions for those who are already here.
Word to the Wise 
Build the fence. Sorry, we must protect our nation.
Blessings,
Shirley
You have changed my mind on some things. I was previously deceived by the liberal “children of illegal immigrants should be treated just like citizens, because it’s not their fault their parents brought them into the country” argument. It’s not like education, school lunches, health care, etc. were taken away from the kids by their parents’ actions — where they came from they had nothing! And even if the kids lose out somehow because their parents illegally emigrated, it’s the PARENTS’ fault! It is the parents’ responsibility to care and provide for their kids.
Sorry – gotta take issue with one part of this post about climbing fences and not learning language or culture – think 500 years ago – or do the native americans not count? How would it be different today if we were speaking their language and living their culture (even though we didn’t consider what they had a nation). Just a thought – call me stupid.
No, you’re not stupid, but there is a BIG difference between armed invasion and immigration. If collectively, a country chooses to invade us militarily, let’s each get our guns and see who wins. If we are talking about legal immigration, then each immigrant must abide by the rules of the host country.
I appreciated your comments since you are coming from a different perspective than many others. This is a very complex problem and there are no easy answers. I agree that we must first control the border, but I don’t necessarily agree with those that think a fence is the answer. I have yet to see a fence that would be much of a deterrant if someone really wanted to cross it. They will find a way over it, under it, or through it if they really want to unless the fence is under constant surveillance 24-7 for its entire length. But if we are able to provide that kind of sureveillance, do we really need to invest the money in a fence that must be maintained.
As far the people that are here now illegally, I have heard many people say that we cannot allow them to stay because they have broken the law. Yes they have broken the law, but there are millions of people who are completely legal residents who have broken laws in the past and continue to break them every day. The most frequently broken laws are speed limits and other driving requirements. There are many that skirt the law in IRS situations. I agree that breaking the law is not right in any situation, but trying to find all of these law breakers and tearing apart their families becomes an impossible situation both for the law-breakers and for the law enforcers. I believe that we should look for some way to allow them to stay and become legal.
On December 16, 2005, the United States House of Representatives passed the Border Protection, Antiterrorism, and Illegal Immigration Control Act of 2005 (H.R. 4437). This bill calls for mandatory electronic verification of all employees to be authorized to work in the United States. In addition, this bill calls for increased paperwork penalties for employers and up to $25,000 per person for violations that don’t adhere to the new regulations. Furthermore, the bill would change into a felony with jail terms for what until now has been a civil violation for a person’s unauthorized presence in the United States. The U.S. Senate will now be asked to approve this legislation. If you thought you were paying to much for your housecleaning and produce now… just wait! Its going to cost you 10.00 dollars for a happy meal
I was an illegal immigrant
Now let’s think about this for a minute, can there really be a solution to this problem? I find it hilarious that the same “clowns” that are so opposed to illegals being here are the same ones that demand that they not pay more than $10.00/hour to have weeds pulled in there back yard. My recommendation for this controversial issue is two- fold 1) We need tighter security at the border. This is a must for the safety of our country. We don’t need protection from Mexican’s, we need protection from Terrorists (or “Freedom Fighters” as CNN calls them). We need to remember that most Mexicans, Philipinos, Vietnamese, Chinese, Indians, etc come here for one thing and thats to work. 2) We need to hold Employers responsible for who they are hiring. If me, as a business owner, understands that I am held accountable to the government to only hire legal residents/or citizens I’m going to do a thoruogh job of screeniong potential employees. Correct me if I’m wrong but it seems that in the case of landscaping and construction the consumer is not saving any money. When an employer hires the illegals on the side of the road most of the time the employer is reaping all the “savings” and not the consumer. Just a thought. I’m very proud of my heritage and culture but I understand that it’s only because of the freedom of this country that I can completely enjoy it!
I agree that from a national perspective things work better when everyone plays by the rules. It would be quite unfair for millions of people who have broken the law to suddenly be rewarded, while many professionals who could contribute significantly to our country’s well-being are denied entrance every year. (Unfortunately, this isn’t a simple problem with a simple solution. Within the same family you may have both legal and illegal immigrants – including minors, especially those who were minors when they arrived, no fault of their own, and have grown up here. It wouldn’t seem fair to send them back to a country they know nothing of. Complex, unfortunately.)
It’s pretty obvious what is driving illegal immigration – money. The money the U.S. companies make through their labor (and so they lobby congress to go easy on them and not enforce the law), and also the money the immigrants dream of making. I once asked a group of illegal immigrants what they would do if someone gave them $10,000 free and clear. Without exception, every one of them said they would return home – to build the house they were saving for, or reunite with their families. It’s all about money. Kind of sad in a way.
I keep hearing the argument that we are a nation of immigrants, but we have a right to set the rules for how people immigrate. We are THE MOST generous country in the world when it comes to immigration, with the possible exception of Canada. Most other countries make it extremely difficult to immigrate. Just try as a U.S. citizen to immigrate to (not just visit) India, Mexico, China or the Philippines.
And of course we need to protect our borders. No doubt about that. No argument here.
I think there is another side to this that doesn’t get talked about too often in the debate. From a Christian perspective there are two things that I think should be emphasized. In Christian Hispanic groups, it has been reported (and it has been my personal experience) that the issue of breaking the law (in several areas), and the issue of having to continuously lie about so many things, is rarely raised as an issue of discipleship for Christians who are here illegally. Isn’t it in their best interests to learn to trust God to meet their needs legally? That bothers me. It does not serve these folks to pretend this issue doesn’t exist, or treat it as a forbidden topic.
(On the other hand, having lived in Mexico City for 10 years, it is easy to understand why a Latin American has little regard for the law. Most of what they have lived with is corruption. I began to get infected with that myself the longer I was there. And it can be argued that our own government sends a mixed message to the illegals themselves about what the law really is – if you can get across the border, we aren’t going to mess with you. The fact that law enforcement and the IRS have express policies of not communicating information about illegal immigrants to Immigration shows that the government itself hasn’t been taking the law all that seriously, sort of winking at it while taking the money from business lobbyists. And all the states who help illegals get drivers licences, etc. Although it seems the tide is turning.)
The other issue, and the more important one, in my opinion, that gets almost no discussion (from what I observe) is that of justice and mercy. All the above is from a political perspective, from the perspective of a U.S. citizen. But what about Christians as part of a worldwide body, under the one Kingdom of God? What is our responsibility? I certainly don’t think we should flaut the law or ignore law-breaking. But most of us here in the U.S. live an incredibly privileged lifestyle compared to almost anywhere else in the world. To only say that they need to obey the law is not enough. Most could not get here legally. Obeying U.S. law is only one part of the issue. And to say that we just need to legalize those here illegally is not actually a solution (even though many Christian groups seem to think that this is the best they can do).
Biblically we have a responsibility to find a way to help those with less resources. (I am not saying that we should feel guilty or that we are somehow wrong to be in this position.) We have a responsiblity to find ways to truly care for those with less material resources, to do justice, to show mercy. What does that mean? It means thinking beyond our national needs. Maybe it means becoming more involved in helping those in underdeveloped nations, particularly our Christian brothers and sisters, to find ways to make a decent living in their own countries – creative businesses, etc. Groups like Samaritan’s Purse are doing just this. But so much more can be done.
Even if we legalize all the illegal immigrants, we aren’t going to make a dent in the large number of poor who don’t come here. Many of those coming here to Cincinnati are from extremely poor areas of southern Mexico (Chiapas) and Guatemala, many of them believers in Christ. But they live pretty miserable lives when they get here. There has to be a better way to help them. Our church gives food and clothing to any needy person who comes, but while this is compassionate, that is just a band-aid.
The real solution to the problem of the poor is going to take a lot more work than any of the solutions I hear in the national debate or at the “water cooler.” I think we need to go beyond the bounds of the current discussion as Christians, to go beyond only the discussion of our national interests. All of this has helped raised my consciousness to their needs and my responsibility as a Christian to the poor of other nations. And quite honestly I have realized just how selfish my own viewpoint has been.
Really good points, Carl, regarding Christian principles and the continual “lying” that being illegal requires. I would like you to share more about what you mean when you say that people in Latin American countries have “little regard for the law”. What I have seen is that lying “to the government” is seen as ok, kind of like a Christian businessman who fudges the truth on his IRS forms (it’s just the government).
Definitely a deep, difficult topic.
Keep in mind that this is all anecdotal, only based on my limited experience. I’m sure someone has written about this somewhere. And I’m sure Jim himself could comment about this.
In Mexico the penalties are harsh and applied (it seems) arbitrarily, and you can always buy your way out. (In our system money also can bend justice, only it comes through the level of legal advice and advocate you can pay for. If you can’t, you are screwed. Our system itself is not completely just.) The corruption ruins the system. There is really no justice. The corruption affects the beat cop (who are paid poorly to begin with) and the federal prosecutors and judges. It is assumed that every cop takes bribes. And the police are often allied with some gang, or under their influence. And the federal police are the worst. So, people fear the law, rather than respecting it. And they have no respect for it. There is nothing to respect. People avoid cops. Many say that behind everything in Mexico are the narcos. At the least, they are a huge influence on everything – because of the billions of dollars that they pour through the country.
Since crime is increasing all over Mexico, there is a general sense that things are out of control. The system doesn’t work. This also increases the lack of respect.
If you hit someone in a car accident and injure them, or kill them, you go immediately to jail and it could cost you thousands of dollars to get out. That’s why many drivers will run from an accident, even bus drivers. You are guilty until proven innocent.
No working class person directly pays taxes in Mexico. It is automatically taken out of their paycheck, and that is all they have to do. They don’t file returns. The only people who actually file a tax form are people who run their own business or are paid directly for their professional services. And here there is also a huge amount of fraud. Plus Mexico’s taxes are awful. It’s a wonder anyone can make money there. There is a 15% value added tax on most purchases and transactions, so that’s where a lot of their taxes come in.
Also a huge amount of the economy runs on cash, so a ton of transactions are never taxed. Very little paid by check, and much less credit card use, although this is increasing. A much lower percentage of people actually have a bank account, although this is also increasing.
So, here again, people hardly even have a concept of being honest on a tax form.
And then there is the generally greater laxity in terms of valuing the truth.
Now, I knew people (professionals) who paid their taxes, who observed the law to the best of their ability. So, this is not everybody.
So, you couple the lack of respect for the law with a feeling that you could never advance economically (the push factor), whether you are poor or not (unemployment is much higher there – as well as underemployment – a high percentage of people never used the professional degrees they worked hard to earn, there were no jobs), and also the sense (partly fantasy and partly true) that there are thousands of dollars waiting for you if you can just cross the border (the pull factor) – and people will do what we would consider desparate and even illegal acts to change their life. Plus the businesses here who are more than willing to pay in cash, or to pretend they don’t know whether your documents are genuine, other businesses seeking to make money from Hispanics, and a government which doesn’t really seriously enforce the law, plus a huge land border… Plus the huge existing Spanish-speaking population encouraging you to come across… And you have the current situation.
Albino posted, “…Could I climb the fence around your house, move into your house without permission, refuse to become a part of your family’s culture or learn your family’s language, then demand that your family pay for my education and medical care?…”
I might add, “…then demand that your family pay for my education and medical care, all the while calling you a racist and insulting your flag?”
Albino, this says it all, and belies the so-called Christianity of the Hispanic churchgoers who want me to love and respect them as they love and respect themselves but refuse to love and respect me as they would be loved and respected. I applaud all the genuine Christians on these blogs who sincerely try to discern the right path for themselves on this issue. I encourage everyone to do what is right, but when you advocate a policy of amnesty and the unavoidable cost of its accompanying unearned benefits, you are now imposing your choices on your neighbor, and you have crossed the line from making your own sacrifices to imposing unwanted sacrifices upon your neighbor. I challenge you to find a scriptural reference for imposing taxes on your neighbors to pay for social programs. Of course we should be good stewards and be generous with the needy and the church, but when you tax your neighbor’s pocket for your vision of good works it is theft and no longer a gift.
How can anyone who builds his house on a foundation of lying (about employment eligibility), cheating (by using false identication and accepting illegal labor conditions to gain competitive advantage) and stealing ($Billions in unearned benefits and social services) expect to be considered a good neighbor or teach their children to be good neighbors?
Some immigrants bring the best of their culture, and some bring the worst. Extreme corruption, shameful deception, and thoughtless reliance on the labor of others represents the worst.
[…] Today, President Bush signed the bill authorizing the building of 700 miles of a double-fence, fifteen-feet high between Mexico and the US. I know this will make many Republicans happy and will enflame Mexicans, once again, against our government. I have mixed feelings about this fence.What I know is that our border with Mexico is a joke right now. Millions of people come and go with impunity, and I’m sure many Arabs from the Middle East are among them. I have already blogged my thoughts on immigration in general, but now that this wall (knock on wood) will be a reality, will it stop illegal immigration, and will it make wealthy Mexicans angry enough to boycott businesses on the border of Texas? […]
Sadly, these issues are going to become irrelevant once the North American Union is in place. Bush is just trying to appease the republican base with the fence issue, which is a joke anyway to any type of solution. His relationship with Fox, and the dialogue of them both, leads me to believe he does not want to stop anyone from coming over at all illegally.. No, this country will very shortly be turned into a EU type based union with Mexico, and Canada.. Quietly but systematically, the Bush Administration is advancing the plan to build a huge NAFTA Super Highway, four football-fields-wide, through the heart of the U.S. along Interstate 35, from the Mexican border at Laredo, Tex., to the Canadian border north of Duluth, Minn… Here is a link to many articles talking about the North American Union, time is running out people….http://news.google.com/news?q=north+american+union&hl=en&hs=c2D&lr=&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&sa=X&oi=news&ct=title
Wow, you feel strongly about that, huh? INteresting, but I think it will be a cold day in “you know where” before we have open borders with Mexico
I wish you were right, but that is what they are planning.. Please, go see that link on google news about the topic. When I first learned of it, I almost feel out of my chair, thinking, an EU union type of union here, no, the American people would never stand for it. But, most Americans dont know about it. And with the new “Military Commistions Act” in place, there will be little that anyone can do about it either. Seperations of power has been in place for many good reasons. The current administration has eroded those seperations to the point of dictatorship. A dictator is a ruler whose powers are omnipotent, that is, unconstrained by external or superior law and has the power to take whatever actions he wants without concerning himself about whether they are legal. Anything the dictator does is legal because he is the law. it is entirely possible to have a democratically elected dictator.. Bush has made 3 statements about being a dictator.
1.”You don’t get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot easier.” Describing what it’s like to be governor of Texas.
(Governing Magazine 7/98).
2.”I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don’t agree with each other, but that’s OK. If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I’m the dictator,”-CNN.com, December 18, 200..http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0012/18/nd.01.html
3. “A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there’s no question about it, “- Business Week, July, 30, 2001..http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/jul2001/nf20010730_347.htm
Just the fact that the leader of the free world is saying such things is distrubing to me, at least..
Also his grandfather Prescott Bush financed Hitler and Nazi Germany. That is found in the National Archives, and was featured in the oldest national newspaper, ” The New Hampshsire Gazette”… http://www.nhgazette.com/cgi-bin/NHGstore.cgi?user_action=detail&catalogno=NN_Bush_Nazi_2
The Bush family also has documented ties to the Bin Laden family…http://www.judicialwatch.org/1685.shtml
Yes, friends, very scary indeed…
Sorry for getting of subject, but I do feel that these are very important matters that all should know about today…
After all my research, I feel that the US is in the same situation Germany was in during the Nazi takeover. They did not realize that it was taking place, and while it was taking place, they mistakenly supported it… Well, history does have I tendency to repeat itself I suppose…
EA, let me be up-front here and say that I admire President George W. Bush very much. I voted for him when he was governor of Texas and voted for him twice to be the President. I am happy with the way he has fought the war on terror, I am pleased with the way he signed a bill against partial-birth abortion, and I am proud of his statements that credit Jesus Christ with his salvation and freedom from alcoholism.
I have a few disagreements with President Bush, and one of them is failure to protect our southern border for so many years. I know he wants a solution that connects willing workers in Mexico with jobs in the US, and so do I, but I think border enforcement should have come long ago. (and the latest thing is that environmental groups are planning to sue to put “holes’ in the fences so that endangered animals can crawl through (I wish I was making this up).
As you your comments on Bush the dictator….Bush was obviously joking in the context of those remarks. He couldn’t even get his social security reform or many of his judge appointments through congress (a dictator would have no problem). And even if you’re no Bush fan, just wait 2 years, and he’ll be back on his ranch in Crawford.
I respect your believe in whom you have voted for.. However, the current bills that have gone through congress; by his hand, such as the “Military Commissions Act”http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=109_cong_bills&docid=f:s3930enr.txt.pdf
This act; if read carefully, I think will disturb you greatly… There is also something else in which very few know about today, and that is the new no fly law for all Americans..http://www.wakeupfromyourslumber.com/node/64
And the administrations desire for Marshal law…http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2006/10/1732834.php
I agree, the border issues is very important, but I think that the Canadian border is much more important than the south.. Also, the North American Union will do away with this issue anyhow.. I mean honestly, do we all really want this country turning into a Union like that of the EU, and does anyone really understand what that will mean for this country…
You have made a reference to Christ… I honestly think that Mr. Bush has used this as a very decietfull means to win the Christian base.. He has never publicly been to a church service; even for the 911 victims, nor shown any prove of his ‘Christian’ believes.. He also; while at Yale, was a member of the secret society Skull and Bones, which partisipates in accult activities…
He has lied about Irag.. Saddam had nothing to do with Al-Qaeda. There were no WMDs’, something in which the NSA, and CIA told the Administration before the war, and still there is not evidence to support that position by the administration..
Now, Jesus spoke about lying, and about war, as well as greed and lust, and worshiping the accult.. All of which are contridictory to his actions, and words…
Was he really joking about being a dictator, if so, Im not laughing… And after seeing his ‘actions’, his fruits, Im not quite so sure he was ‘joking’..
Im sorry, but I cannot just sit around and wait till he goes back to the ranch.. For these things in the ‘now’ will have affects far reaching into the future for this country, if this country exists in the future… You might laugh at this thought, as Im sure many in Rome would at the thought of that empire ever not existing.. But again, look into the “North American Union”, please, I beg you!!
One of the most important things, is when Jesus was in the desert for 40 days, and Satan showed him all the kindoms of the Earth, and would give him power of the Kindoms, if he only gave Satan one act of worship… If Satan were able to give these kingdoms to Jesus, then logicaly Satan must own them, all of them..
I thankyou for your insight, and feedback, and your admiration of life, and the right to life. But I think that the right should exstend to everyone, no matter where they are in this world, no matter what there culture, or religion.. The administration is metaphoricaly aborting life in the craddle of all of our lives, much like a woman who has an abortion, saying she did it, just because she can, and that is her right as the owner of her body…
Respectfully..
:To the admin: Sorry about the double post, my browser is haning as of late.. If it would be better for some, I can be reached at rea1001@gmail.com, if you would like to talk further about any issue…
One other thing, for now… See this link, for just one of many now ‘secret’ laws, which effect our rights directly, afforded to us by the Constitution…http://www.papersplease.org/gilmore/index.html
I admire your passion, EA, but I don’t think you’re giving Bush a fair shake. Now that the dems have won the House and probably the Senate, you should start aiming your guns at them.
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